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Energy from Buoyancy?
'Sounded like a Machine Gun'http://groups.yahoo.com/group/free-energy/message/7814 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 12:34:02 -0600
The man who told me about his first attempt at designing & building this device, said,
"When I sufficiently filled up the water-column with water, the cans took off rotating
very-rapidly and sounded like a machine-gun. It ran until the seal failed, but I have proven the
principle to work, and have since perfected it's workable-application." Seen a VideoAndy Pears has seen a video of a working device of this ilk. He lives 300 miles south of the inventor, and has been invited to come take a look in person. (Feb. 28, 2004)
I assure you this ferrofluid system does work.
I have to admit there is considerable drag using this stuff. As long as the surface
area to volume ratio of the float and drag co-efficient to volume ratio is kept below a
given value, (I don't have to hand where I am right now), the system will run until the water
has evaporated or the drag has increased past the crucial threshold.
The only problem I have seen with this system is that the floats get dirty by picking up the
ferrofluid which increases drag. The floats also cause the evaporation of the water.
I believe this can be remedied by coating the floats in a Teflon polymer and some kind of
hydrophobic coating.
I will do my best to video this system working at the end of April. I should be in a very
good position to travel to record it working.
very busy right now with a new business that will provide me with a substantial research budget.
this system does have some tricky to balance thresholds I must admit.
The amount of water that can be suspended above a Ferro fluid seal is determined by the strength
and size of the seal itself, which is calculated by the volume/area ratio of the float etc .
Andy.
Hard to Get Good Sealhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/free-energy/message/7816 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 19:17:04 -0000 No Photos; Alternate Solutionshttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/free-energy/message/7817 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 19:45:13 -0000 No, I cannot post a picture because I never saw his device. We merely discussed it's/his principle. This was also a few years ago discussed. He claimed to have built another with a better seal, and stated that he had perfected a method of mechanical-connection, to like run an electrical generator or whatever one would seek, but would tell me none of his engineering-particulars. He was kind enough to reveal his concept under the influence of a couple of "beers", although he was initially reluctant to do so. I thought about the concept for quite awhile, and concluded, eventually, that it was QUITE viable. I have intended to build a "sample" device such as this but have not yet been able to get the time or facilities to do so. The question of the "seal" should be easy enough to solve, like a "rotating-donut" or something, and yes there would be enough energy- gain to run a small-pump to recycle water back into the water-column- volume. To me it is just like the concept of the internal-combustion-engine, or ANY other device, like the telephone, etc. Once the principle is established, the rest is up to it's perfection through development of the idea. He & I DID discuss, however, some other ideas, about increasing the density of the liquid-medium to like "mercury", and reducing the canister-mass with like "titanium". We discussed that "entire cities" like LA, Chicago, near coastal-waters, could be energized by such a device if utilizing the local water-level supplies. I think much is possible here with this idea. I wanted to share it with you-all and see what the free-world/free-man might do with it. PEH Donut Sealhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/free-energy/message/7828 From: "behillman" <chris_hillman@msn.com> "Donut seal", is just a generic term. It would "look" like a "donut", or any kind of seal with an ID & OD that would work. It might be a good idea to use two seals, with a spacing between them, to minimize water leakage when the space between two of the canisters is passing through. This drawing, etc., only describes the principle. All of the engineering is up to making it work. PEH Modifications / Do-it-yourself Kit
From: Sterling
D. Allan
Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 7:02 PM
Subject: Energy from Buoyancy
[If this is a valid design concept,] I would recommend the following modifications on the design: canisters should be shaped so as to flow through liquid with as little disturbance as possible, while also fitting on a conveyor pulley. There should be a tray for collecting dripping fluid to return it to the chamber. The chamber should be larger, and doesn't necessarily need to be round in shape. The exit should be longer, and at an angle over the chamber for longer dripping time to reduce liquid escape from the chamber. Multiple canister strings could be going through a single chamber. The design should be optimized for slow rotation with high-torque, to avoid spillage of the liquid. The liquid should not be toxic, to reduce danger in servicing; and danger from damage to the device. It would be neat to create a version of this that could be fabricated from items found in most households as a do-it-yourself kit. It would also be neat to create a power-generating design that could be built with off-the-shelf components. Sterling Already on "Does Not Work" List
Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 9:39 PM
Subject: RE: [pes_ee] Energy from Buoyancy
requires more energy to mantain the lost water level than the output and it generates 17PSI per 32 feet height at bottom pressure so pressure equalizes , /wild goose ? ? Hector Would have Been Used Anciently, if?
From: "Roland Paterson-Jones" <roland@rolandpj.com>
To: "'Sterling D. Allan'" <sterlingda@pureenergysystems.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 9:52 PM
Subject: Re: [roland] [free-energy] Energy from Buoyancy
problem with it yet. It's so simple it should have been invented by on of the ancient cultures, tho. That's the only thing that worries me. Engineering-wise, the problem, of course is the 'donut' seal at the bottom of the water column. It needs to stretch to allow the canisters to pass, but still seal adequately around the 'rope' between them. It might help if the canisters had a cone-shape at the top and bottom, and were long and thin. A design that makes even more sense is a flexible sectioned pipe (like bamboo) all of the same width. I'll let you know if I find a thought experiment to counter this proposal. My 2c. Roland * * * * *
I've Tried; It Doesn't WorkFrom: "Art Corbit" <alc111@c...> Forces Will Balance Out -- Try Tide EnergyFrom: "Fredrik Buch" <fredrik2@i...> Archimedes principle and High School math say NOFrom: "Jerry Dufour" <jerryhd@earthlink.net> He said it Worked; Tried to Get a PatentResponding to: integrity & Buoyancy machine claim
From: Paul
Hillman
Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 5:36 PM
Subject: Re: integrity & Buoyancy machine claim
Sterling,
I do not believe that the man who told me about this was "lying". He COULD have been, of
COURSE, but I don't think so!! He was an "older" mechanical engineer with-whom I worked,
for a couple of years.
I don't know if he actually attempted to patent his device, but he told me that he was having to
call it something like, "An unequal-liquids, displacement-device(???)", because the
Patent-Office won't accept perpetual-motion claims.
Anyway, even though I never saw his attempt (this was back in about 1991), nor have I been yet
able to attempt building such a device, I do not see the idea as being unworkable, even
mathematically.
Why do submarines "fly" to the surface when ballast-water is expelled, even if
"dragging" a weight? How do anti-shipping mines "float" submerged? How do
hot-air-balloons lift their gondolas?
Imagine a "beach-ball" submerged in water, to which a weight is attached. This weight is
actually a square-container holding water The weight of the water in the container is enough to
counter-balance the "beach-ball's" attempt at buoyancy. (Similar to a military
anti-shipping mine.) The beach-ball is attempting to rise, but the weight prevents it from doing
so. The beach-ball remains at some certain-level below the surface of the water.
Now, a "drain" is attached to the "weight" and it's interior-water begins to
be removed. As the "weight" reduces in mass, the beach-ball will begin to rise,
regardless of the vertical-water-column-weight, of the water above it.
I surmise that the energy required to pull-in another canister at the bottom of this machine, can
obviously be derived from a sufficient-number of canisters above it, which are producing
"lift" in the water-column.
Another example, would be to take such a tube, with a round seal, and barely insert an
aluminum-can with an attached string. Then fill the column with water and measure the amount of
force required to pull the can up into the water-column, using your hands. (I'm SURE that it would
not be "impossible" to pull it in there.)
Then compute the amount of water/air required to produce this amount of force. Supply that number
of extra, submerged canisters, (plus a couple more), and I'd be willing to bet that the energy
exerted by the canisters would equal the amount of energy which you had supplied-mechanically with
your hands.
Energy required to pull-in next canister = A
Lift-energy exerted by one submerged canister = 1/2 A, = A/2
10 submerged-canisters = 10(A/2) = 5A
5A-A = 4A ; = (Gain)
As SOON as I can, I will attempt all of these
PEH
I'm Going to Try it Myself, Soon
Sterling,
Also there is another factor which must be computed in the general-formulas. As the new-canister
begins to enter the water-volume, it too begins to exert lift. The more it enters, the
more lift it produces, thus countering it's "anti-forces".
I think that this is pretty interesting to pursue. It certainly wouldn't cost that much to
experiment with it, would it?
PEH
* * * * *
Sterling,
Wait, I might have to rescind my last argument as below stated. I forgot for a moment!!
PEH
It Works; There's One 100 miles North of Here
From: "Andy Pears" <andypearsthefirst@yahoo.co.uk>
To: "Sterling D. Allan" <sterlingda@greaterthings.com>
Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: Energy from Buoyancy
its been done long ago not far from where i live. the seal used was FERROFLUID supported by big rare earth magnets shaped like cups around where the seal sits. it does work as long as the chain doesn't go to fast around the wheels. andy.
I assure you it does work, perhaps not like the diagram. The cylinders need to be slip streamed and wax coated. Preferably vacuum rather than air filled. The key is the ferrofluid seal which is supported by a strong magnetic field from 2 big rare earth magnets cup shaped around the seal. Water must be dripped back into the tube as some is lost through evaporation etc. The ferrofluid seal from what I have seen is around 3 inches thick. I will be building a replication of this in April when my business is launched. the rig which proves this free energy is only 100 miles north of me so I will make a video of it working with the inventors permission. Hope this helps. Andy. Let's See the Proof
From: <erickrieg@verizon.net>
To: "Sterling D. Allan" <sterlingda@greaterthings.com>
Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: [free_energy] Fw: Water Device
Sterling, I admit that there may be some way to get energy from cold fusion or the aether - but floating power machines? - they have been failing consistently for hundreds of years. I think it is time to write them off just as it is time to write off praying to Zeus or pulling the brain out of a mummy to help it to get an afterlife. Anyone promoting a buoyancy engine shouldn't be taken seriously until they at least have a very high level of proof. just my opinion Similar to ELSA Device
Hi Sterling,
Re buoyancy discussion see John Herring "ELSA"
device theverylastpageoftheinternet. Don Adsitt site.
May trigger ideas for experimentation. John Herring built a
school science demo I understand but have heard no proof.
Cheers Ashley
Do the Math
From: [A. Engineer]
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 2:28 AM
Subject: Re: Aram: Energy from Buoyancy
I've seen a number of buoyancy machine diagrams like this. Most of them have a serious
friction problem. In this case, it's the do-nut seal. Assuming you can make the seal
frictionless, the analysis goes as follows. A. [Engineer]
Additional Comments
See also
Index created by Sterling D. Allan,
Feb. 15, 2004 |
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